Legislature(2017 - 2018)BUTROVICH 205
03/13/2018 03:30 PM Senate STATE AFFAIRS
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| Audio | Topic |
|---|---|
| Start | |
| SB163 | |
| Adjourn |
* first hearing in first committee of referral
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
| + | SB 163 | TELECONFERENCED | |
| + | TELECONFERENCED |
SB 163-DEFINITION OF COMMERCIAL MOTOR VEHICLES
3:30:57 PM
CHAIR MEYER announced the consideration of Senate Bill 163 (SB
163).
3:31:36 PM
SENATOR EGAN joined the committee meeting.
3:31:50 PM
MIKE LESMANN, Legislative Liaison, Office of the Commissioner,
Alaska Department of Transportation and Public Facilities,
Juneau, Alaska, stated that Deputy Commissioner John Binder will
address the committee regarding SB 163 as well as Director Dan
Smith from the Division of Measurements Standards and Commercial
Vehicle Enforcement.
3:32:49 PM
JOHN BINDER, Deputy Commissioner, Alaska Department of
Transportation and Public Facilities, Anchorage, Alaska,
provided an overview of SB 163 as follows:
Senate bill 163 proposes to bring Alaska's definition
of a commercial motor vehicle into the twenty-first
century. SB 163's proposed changes will benefit
farmers who transport agricultural commodities or
supplies in Alaska because existing restrictions on
farm vehicles limit their movement to within 150 miles
of the farmer's farm. SB 163 would allow farmers to
operate anywhere in Alaska.
The Federal Highway Reauthorization Act of 2012,
"Moving Ahead for Progress in the Twenty-First Century
Act," commonly referred to as MAP-21, made the federal
regulations of farmers less restrictive than are
currently existing in Alaska statute.
SB 163 also proposes that the transportation of
hazardous materials be amended to only apply to
quantities of substances that require a placard
regardless of the size of the vehicle.
Finally, the definition of "school bus" is updated to
provide clarity for when school buses are exempt from
commercial motor vehicle requirements.
3:34:27 PM
DAN SMITH, Director, Division of Measurement Standards and
Commercial Vehicle Enforcement, Alaska Department of
Transportation and Public Facilities, Juneau, Alaska, said SB
163 does three things: changes, clarifies and reconciles. He
detailed a sectional analysis as follows:
The first section, which is AS 19.10.300, where the
change we anticipated making was in AS 19.10.399,
"definitions;" what we wanted to mirror with those
changes in AS 19.10.300, which is "financial
responsibility," when we are using the word "vehicular
way or area," in definition in AS 28.90.990 and AS
19.10.399, those two terms are used together with one
definition, so we just wanted to make that really
clear. An "area" for our purposes, for commercial
vehicle enforcement, would be if a tanker truck is at
a Holiday Gas Station that's not on the highway,
that's an "area" to us so you still fall under our
jurisdiction and have to do things such as attend to
your load of HAZMAT. So, we just wanted to make sure
that was really clear.
Page 2, when we start to introduce this idea of a
"covered farm vehicle," this is the MAP-21 language
that the federal government came out with, "covered"
does not mean "contained" or "confined," that just
means those vehicles would then fall under this
definition that they are "covered farm vehicles."
Presently in AS 19.10.399, after 150 miles from a
farmer's farm you then are regulated by DOT, meaning
you are going to have all of the inspections,
markings, that sort of thing for those commercial
vehicles; this change would allow those vehicles to
operator anywhere in the state.
We then move on to the HAZMAT portion where we want to
be really clear. There are times when commercial
vehicles are hauling HAZMAT and they would not require
a placard, that's simply hauling a 55-gallon drum of
gasoline for instance, that is not in a quantity that
would require you to have placarding on your vehicle.
Now, if you go place-to-place and pick up 55-gallon
drums and your aggregate weight gets over 1000 pounds
then yes, you are going to have to have a placarding
on your vehicle. So, we just wanted to be really clear
and this is really for emergency response vehicles,
those vehicles that can roll up on a crash and
identify what that hazardous material might be.
The final change is coming up with a new definition
for "school bus operations." Presently in AS 19.10.399
it says, "school buses are not commercial vehicles,"
and that is too broad, that is not compatible with the
federal definition. If you have a school bus and you
are using it commerce; for instance, picking up
passengers from cruise ship and transporting them
which is Senator Egan's situation he described to me,
that is a motor carrier if they are using those school
buses in the summer. So, our definition just needs to
be tightened up. So, when you are using a school bus
from home-to-school or school-to-home, they are
exempt, they don't need to fall under DOT
requirements, but if you are in commerce in
furtherance of your business then yes, you are a motor
carrier.
3:37:47 PM
SENATOR COGHILL noted that the new definition of "school bus"
specifies carrying more than 10 passengers. He asked if the old
definition was 15 passengers.
MR. SMITH replied the number of passengers remains at 10. He
noted that the more-than-15-passenger number was in the
definition of a commercial motor vehicle.
SENATOR WILSON asked him to identify examples of some of the
farm vehicles that would be able to travel more from passage of
the bill. He asked if the change includes semi-trucks, horse
trailers, and extended trailers for transporting animals.
MR. SMITH specified that "legal vehicles" are as follows:
We are talking about a variety of vehicles, we are
talking legal vehicles, vehicles of legal size. So,
those in my world are vehicles that are 26,001 pounds
or below, meaning a non-CDL holder vehicle; and then
26,001 and above meaning a combination vehicle, we are
talking a tractor trailer. Yes, you could have a horse
trailer and a truck-tractor pulling that, or this
could simply be a straight truck which would be
typical of flatbed.
3:39:07 PM
SENATOR WILSON asked if the increased hours on the road for farm
vehicles will pose a safety concern for the department.
MR. SMITH answered that he does not know that safety would be
measurably decreased by allowing the exemptions regarding hours
of service and a driver's duty record status. He noted that any
unsafe operation is still prohibited and enforced if there was
an unsafe driver who was not using prudent judgement in the
operation of their farm vehicle.
CHAIR MEYER asked how hard it is to get a placard and what it
costs.
MR. SMITH replied he is not certain what the placards cost and
will follow up; however, the HAZMAT placards are readily
available and easy to access.
CHAIR MEYER asked if farm equipment is identified as trucks and
flatbeds, not tractors.
MR. SMITH answered yes. He detailed that the division is talking
about legal-sized and legal-weight vehicles. Changes are not
being made for implements of husbandry.
CHAIR MEYER asked if "school bus operations" means, "Use of a
school bus to transport students and school personnel to and
from school." He inquired if school buses can be used to take
kids to athletic events, etcetera.
3:42:03 PM
MR. SMITH replied that there is a very fine line when talking
about school-sponsored activities. He said the intent for school
bus operations is from home-to-school, school-to-school, or
school-to-home. He explained that an outing to a museum as part
of a student's curriculum would be exempt. He said where it
starts to get gray is for example when students are being
transported to a football game, a situation where the carrier
would be regulated as a motor carrier because the carrier is
carrying students in furtherance of their business that is not
part of their contract to the government for the students. He
explained that the motor carriers have the correct operating
authority with USDOT numbers and properly qualified drivers to
switch between exempted during the morning and after school;
however, when doing the other activities, the motor carriers
know that they fall under different levels of financial
responsibility and driver qualifications.
CHAIR MEYER replied that Mr. Smith's explanation is confusing.
He asked if the school districts know that some of the buses are
being used for events that are a different status than during
the day.
MR. SMITH disclosed that he has had conversations with the
school districts to clarify that. He said the exemption process
is clear to the motor carriers and is clearer now to early
education.
CHAIR MEYER remarked that he did not see anybody in attendance
from the school districts but would take Mr. Smith's word that
he had spoken to the school districts.
3:44:30 PM
SENATOR EGAN noted that on page 4 the bill states that a bus
would only carry "public" school kids. He asked if safety
standards should be the same for all kids no matter what kind of
school they go to. He inquired Mr. Smith if he has coordinated
with the Alaska Department of Education and Early Development
(DEED).
MR. SMITH answered yes.
SENATOR EGAN asked if DEED has seen the rules.
MR. SMITH answered yes.
SENATOR EGAN asked if DEED has seen the corrected bill.
MR. SMITH said he believes that the division and DEED are all on
the same page, now. He addressed Senator Egan's question on bus
safety standards for all children and emphasized that the
division's intent is not to diminish safety standards for
anybody transporting school students.
SENATOR EGAN reiterated that the bill infers "public" students.
MR. SMITH emphasized that the bill does not change the safety
statutes.
CHAIR MEYER remarked that Senator Egan was referring to line 2
on page 4, "Used to transport public pre-elementary, elementary,
or secondary school students to and from school."
SENATOR EGAN concurred with Chair Meyer.
CHAIR MEYER recalled that his children were once picked up in
front of the capital and taken to the Juneau Christian School
SENATOR EGAN stated that he intends to offer an amendment that
eliminates the word "public."
CHAIR MEYER agreed with Senator Egan to simply eliminate the
word "public," then the statute would pertain to all school
buses that transport kids.
MR. SMITH disclosed that he did not want to include "public"
during the statutory cleanup process, the word was added
somewhere else.
SENATOR EGAN reiterated that the word "public" is noted on page
4.
CHAIR MEYER replied that the "public" notation in the bill will
be addressed in the amendment process.
3:47:57 PM
CHAIR MEYER opened public testimony.
3:48:12 PM
ARTHUR KEYES, Director, Division of Agriculture, Alaska
Department of Natural Resources, Palmer, Alaska, testified in
support of SB 163. He said changing the 150-mile rule provides
clarity and certainty for Alaskan farmers. He opined that the
150-mile rule does not work in Alaska; for example, a farmer on
the Kenai Peninsula would travel far more than 150 miles to do
business in Palmer and the same holds true for Delta Junction
and Fairbanks also doing business in Palmer.
3:49:35 PM
AVES THOMPSON, Executive Director, Alaska Trucking Association,
Anchorage, Alaska, testified in support of SB 163. He asserted
that any effort to clarify the statutes makes it easier for the
trucking industry to understand and comply with the statutes and
regulations governing the operation of its businesses. He said
SB 163 reduces the burden on farmers and farm vehicles by
removing the 150-mile restriction on farmers transporting their
covered farm vehicles in the conduct of their business and
allows them to operate statewide. He asserted that SB 163 does
make clear that if operators choose to enter the for-hire world,
they need to comply with commercial vehicle rules and
regulations. He explained that SB 163 provides certainty for
motor carriers of passengers by clearly identifying school bus
operations. He said school buses are not considered commercial
motor vehicles while conducting school bus operations, they too
will be required to comply with the commercial vehicle rules and
regulations if they engage in for-hire transport other than
school-bus operations. He summarized that SB 163 also provides
clarification for carriers transporting hazardous materials in
amounts that require a placard.
MR. THOMPSON addressed an earlier question regarding placards
and noted that the Alaska Trucking Association's office has
placards for sale for a multitude of different materials. He
disclosed that the price is generally less than $5.
3:52:12 PM
JOHN R. DART, President, Dart-Am Farms, Manley Hot Springs
Produce Company, Fairbanks, Alaska, testified in support of SB
163 because the distances in Alaska are huge. He disclosed that
one-way delivery from Dart-Am Farms to the south Anchorage
farmer's market is 500 miles.
3:54:26 PM
AMY SEITZ, Executive Director, Alaska Farm Bureau, Soldotna,
Alaska, testified in support of SB 163 because the state needs
to update its statutes to be in line with the federal
regulations. She said Alaska is a vast state with long distances
between the farms and cities. She asserted that requiring
farmers to operate their vehicles under commercial vehicle laws
just to pick up supplies adds significant cost and burden.
3:56:46 PM
CHAIR MEYER closed public testimony.
He asked Mr. Smith to readdress the definition of "hazardous
materials," specifically the regulation of weight.
MR. SMITH explained that the example that he gave for a HAZMAT
Class 3 "flammable liquid" would entail an aggregate weight for
55-gallon drums that is called "other bulk packed packaging." He
specified that when looking at HAZMAT in bulk, the division is
talking about transport of more than 119 gallons, a point where
a HAZMAT placard must be used. He noted that explosives fall
into a category where the division looks at the potential if
something were to go wrong versus weight.
CHAIR MEYER assumed that people making a living with HAZMAT
materials are aware of the regulations. He inquired if taking
some paint to the landfill would require a HAZMAT placard.
MR. SMITH specified that the HAZMAT placards apply to people who
are in commerce. He concurred that people who deal with HAZMAT
are well versed in its transportation.
3:59:17 PM
CHAIR MEYER asked if a painter with excess paint would be
considered commercial.
MR. SMITH replied as follows:
Excellent question and it's a little bit like the farm
exception, those are tools of your trade and at that
point we are not grouping you in as if you are a motor
carrier for hire transporting those types of
materials.
CHAIR MEYER asked if the weight of a truck is noted on the
title.
MR. SMITH explained that on the title the weight is classified
by the Division of Motor Vehicles (DMV) as the "unladen weight;"
however, on the vehicle's door or sill is the gross vehicle
weight rating and gross combination weight rating, the way the
division classifies weights.
CHAIR MEYER asked if the key is commercial versus personal.
MR. SMITH answered yes.
CHAIR MEYER explained that he asks only because some people are
using big trucks for personal use.
MR. SMITH agreed.
CHAIR MEYER stated that Senator Egan would like to offer a
conceptual amendment to eliminate the word public on page 4,
line 2.
4:01:26 PM
SENATOR EGAN moved Conceptual Amendment 1.
4:01:39 PM
CHAIR MEYER announced that hearing no objection, Conceptual
Amendment 1 is adopted.
He noted that there are no fiscal notes for SB 163.
CHAIR MEYER asked Mr. Smith if there is any federal money tied
to the statute change.
MR. SMITH answered no. He pointed out that the Alaska Department
of Transportation and Public Facilities does get monies from the
Federal Motor Carrier Safety Administration to do enforcement on
commercial vehicles.
SENATOR WILSON asked him to address the lack of a fiscal note
and opined that a cost would be incurred in the regulation
updating process.
MR. SMITH answered that updating regulations is part of the
division's budget and the process would be done with existing
resources.
4:03:22 PM
SENATOR COGHILL asked if there will be pushback from taking the
word "public" out of the statute.
MR. SMITH replied as follows:
When I saw that change submitted, I asked what does
"public" mean to you? Does that mean public money is
going towards these entities that are doing this type
of transport? They were just saying "no," these are
public schools that are open to everybody. I tried to
make the point to them that if there's a Christian
school that's doing these same types of activities,
they would then get the same exceptions.
SENATOR COGHILL explained that his intent was to make the topic
very clear.
CHAIR MEYER asked if anything is jeopardized by removing the
word "public" from the statute.
MR. SMITH replied that in his opinion nothing is being
jeopardized.
CHAIR MEYER emphasized that everyone wants all kids to be safe.
MR. SMITH agreed and specified as follows:
I tried to speak to it a little bit before, but in my
world, the enforcement world, part of the chapter is
parts necessary for safe operation, that does not
change, we would still require those vehicles to be in
safe working mechanical condition.
4:05:12 PM
SENATOR GIESSEL moved to report [CSSB 163(STA)], version 30-
GS2597\A as amended from committee with individual
recommendations and attached zero fiscal note.
4:05:30 PM
CHAIR MEYER announced that there being no objection, the motion
carried.
| Document Name | Date/Time | Subjects |
|---|---|---|
| SB163 Sponsor Statement 3.7.18.pdf |
SSTA 3/13/2018 3:30:00 PM |
SB 163 |
| SB163 ver A 3.7.18.pdf |
SSTA 3/13/2018 3:30:00 PM |
SB 163 |
| SB163 Fiscal Note DOT-MSCVE 3.7.18.pdf |
SSTA 3/13/2018 3:30:00 PM |
SB 163 |